KUALA LUMPUR – Two-time former prime minister Tun Dr Mahathir Mohamad’s appearance on today’s edition of the Keluar Sekejap podcast showed that his views on “lazy Malays” and non-Malays are not about to change, despite intense grilling by hosts Khairy Jamaluddin and Shahril Sufian Hamdan.
The topic of Malays and their supposed “complacent” nature and lack of economic advancement was raised early on in the session and was a constant undertone throughout, with the two ex-Umno figures trying to reason with the 98-year-old.
“How can you say that it’s the culture of Malays (to not prioritise economic advancements)? It’s as if you’re saying that it’s in the Malay DNA (to be) resigned to being unsuccessful in business forever.
“Isn’t that unfair, Tun?” Khairy said after Dr Mahathir had gone on at length that the Malay community still failed to uplift themselves even after he had provided them with business opportunities when he was in power. He said this was because they were content with whatever they had.
In response to Khairy, Dr Mahathir admitted that while there might be some exceptions to his theory, Malays who do manage to make a name for themselves are less common than those of other races.
This answer was challenged by Shahril, who reminded the nonagenarian that he had “hurt many people” for repeatedly saying ‘Melayu malas’ (lazy Malays).
“Are you still looking at the matter from a 1930s viewpoint when (current) data and statistics have provided a more complicated image than the one you’re saying?” Shahril asked.
Dr Mahathir then said that he is speaking from a “general” perspective where “only a few” Malays have succeeded.
He added: “There’s no use in getting mad at me. As long as we (Malays) don’t change our way of life, our values and our culture, we cannot compete with other races.”
On the topic of assimilation in multi-racial Malaysia, Khairy said that Malaysia has never insisted non-Malays practice assimilation in the same way Indonesia and Thailand have, as Malaysia upholds integration instead.
“No, that’s not true,” Dr Mahathir responded. “There is assimilation. People from Arab and India, they’re registered as Malays now. It’s not that we didn’t insist on assimilating the Chinese migrants, they refused to do so.
“We want them to be Malay, but they look down on us and refuse to be known as Malays,” Dr Mahathir said.
To this, Khairy, a former health minister, among other portfolios, reminded him that he had once upheld the “unity in diversity” concept, whereby Malaysians celebrate their respective cultural heritage while embracing a shared national identity.
“Sir, unity in diversity, you used that (term) a few times when you were prime minister,” Khairy said, but this saw Dr Mahathir double down on his assertions that “some races” refuse to undergo assimilation.
“I accept their (non-Malays’) contributions. Our country has people of all races, but when there are suggestions that this is not Tanah Melayu, that is what I oppose,” Dr Mahathir said.
Judicial independence and Machiavellian tendencies
The session, which lasted about two hours and twenty minutes, also touched on politics, with Dr Mahathir raising two separate court cases involving politicians to illustrate his accusation that Prime Minister Datuk Seri Anwar Ibrahim supposedly changed his tune on the judiciary’s independence.
“We’ve seen that someone with 47 (charges) against them can have their case dropped, but someone with only one case can be (sentenced to) two lashes of the whip,” Dr Mahathir said.
While he did not mention names, the facts he stated most likely refer to the trials of Deputy Prime Minister Datuk Seri Ahmad Zahid Hamidi and Muar MP Syed Saddiq Syed Abdul Rahman.
An evidently surprised Khairy then said: “Sir, how can you say that? Those were the court’s decisions, Tun.”
On September 4, Zahid had received a conditional discharge on all 47 of his corruption, criminal breach of trust (CBT) and money laundering charges. He was first hit with the charges in 2018 before the trial began the next year.
Syed Saddiq, who is Muda’s sole parliamentary representative, was last week sentenced to nine years in jail, two whips, and a RM10 million fine after the high court here found him guilty on all four counts of CBT, money laundering and funds misappropriation.
He was first hauled to court in 2021 to face the charges.
Shahril, a former Umno information chief, then said: “With all due respect Tun, you’re saying that (Anwar) is inconsistent, but that’s also one of the criticisms against you.
“You used to say that DAP was not good, but when you wanted to win against BN (Barisan Nasional) in 2018, you were willing to work with them.
“Even with PAS, you once said they’re not a good political party for Malaysia, but you’re with them now,” Shahril said.
In answer, Dr Mahathir cited the adage “the enemy of your enemy is your friend,” and added that he had “used” DAP to oust then-prime minister Datuk Seri Najib Razak and the Barisan Nasional (BN) government in the 2018 election.
“If I hadn’t used DAP, we wouldn’t have achieved a majority and Najib would continue to be prime minister. Between DAP and Najib, which one do we need to eliminate? It was all a strategy to reach our goal,” Dr Mahathir said.
To Khairy’s quip on Dr Mahathir’s “Machiavellian” way of politics where the means justify the ends, Dr Mahathir said: “To a certain extent, we have to hold on to that line of thinking.”
In the second half of the session, Shahril raised the issue of corruption and money politics, which he said some in Umno’s current top leadership have blamed on Dr Mahathir, who had previously served as Umno president and BN chairman.
“It wasn’t me that started it, it was Anwar,” Dr Mahathir said, causing Khairy to do a visible double-take, as the former went on blaming his former protege.
This then caused Khairy to question Dr Mahathir on why he failed to take action against such practices if he knew they were happening, to which the reply was:
“That’s a job for officers, not me. When they saw that something was wrong, there was no need for them to wait for the prime minister (to act).
“That wasn’t my job, the police, the (then-Anti Corruption Agency) should have taken action.” – November 13, 2023
